In September of 2017, an obscure government official stood before a small audience at an obscure think tank and described a catastrophe that was unfolding.
The amount of loud shouting and condemnation going on currently is unreal. I thought Trump was very subjectively treated, but I almost feel worse for Biden right now. Biden (for all of his many, many faults) may have made the best Presidential decision in my 30 odd years on this planet. Instead of breathing that huge sigh of relief I feel, we are witnessing just how deep the rot of the MIC runs. It's just incredible. Similar to TDS, I am astounded to see so many typically level minds off kilter on this one. Dude! We just got out of Afghanistan! We already looked like complete idiots. We should be celebrating.
I mostly agree. Biden does deserve credit for actually pulling the plug. And we should be celebrating the end of a fiasco that has cost so much blood and treasure. I also agree that those criticizing Biden for going ahead with the withdrawal. As far as I'm concerned the neocons of both parties can pound sand. But I can't agree is letting Biden off the hook for the incompetent execution of the withdrawal. It's not just optics. This is an ongoing disaster, and only luck will cause this to end without American civilian dead or held hostage.
Biden's decision to get out of Afghanistan has little to do with the failure of the USA to train anybody. In fact, the chaos the USA has left is -exactly- the goal. The poorly executed "withdrawal"; the failure to warn our allies; the breakdown of the visa approvals -- it is all planned. Our Generals aren't so stupid that they couldn't have organized an orderly withdrawal if they wanted it.
The Empire isn't run by idiots. It is run by megalomaniacs. Every James Bond movie you ever saw shows you the real criminal behind the scenes. The problem is that M is on their side.
Also, this Rainer Shea fellow has the hammer and sickle in his Twitter bio and also recently wrote a defense of the DPRK, calling it “the true people’s welfare state!” For real? The DPRK is one of the most repressive countries in the world.
While I agree with the sentiment and don’t doubt that China plays a role in why we are still there, your initial article uses a laughably blatant bit of deceptively-edited CCP propaganda from YouTube as a source, which makes me doubt their credibility. There is also the reality that China was still barely more than a 3rd world country 20 years ago when we went in the first place.
Good one. All you need to know, re: the media (my resume: Boston Globe, Wall Street Journal, and freelanced for countless other magazines like The Nation and wrote op eds in USA Today, etc. 20 years) is that they can always be counted on (always and forever) to be pro-globalist, pro-corporate power, and pro-CIA/Pentagon (read: war). Doesn't matter the network. To this day, Hannity is still wearing FBI and CIA pins on his lapel...MSNBC's Brian Williams is famous for this "big beautiful bombs" commentary over Syria. The one time he was happy about Trump.
Sorry Mike, but the withdrawal was as the Brits like to say a "massive cock up." Troops pulled out before equipment, Bagram closed down way too early, routes to the airport unsecured, the list of ineptitude goes on and on and I will criticize it as much as I like. That being said, too much of the criticism is directed at Biden. Shocking, I know, and this is coming from someone who cannot stand the guy (decades of reasons to dislike him). Biden is just an empty suit these days. He is lucky if he even remembers what decade it is and can barely even answer questions. I seriously doubt he was involved in the detailed planning of this. He just reads lies off the teleprompter and leaving Afghanistan is a decision I respect him for. No, the people I hate are our usual group of State Department and Pentagon idiots. These empty suits have been useless for decades. If they ever had to work a blue collar job the boss would be constantly yelling "YOU HAD ONE JOB!" It is their job to know things, plan things, and prepare for contingencies. Having a few contingency plans in case a country falls apart while you are leaving just seems common sense, not to mention that these idiots had MONTHS to plan for this. For me the biggest lesson of Afghanistan is that America's State Department and Pentagon is populated by useless, bipartisan, career charlatans and has been for decades.
I think it’s too broad to say that the media loves war. I know I know. It gets em headlines at the outset. So the beginning of wars is profitable. In that regard, the tragedy and spectacle, yes they love those shock and awe moments.
But Afghanistan for progressives is a war that exported wokeness under a Biden admin, and before that it advocates simple western ideals like sexual equality. If we were to go to war for oil - which is how they protested some of the GWOT actions. Remember the commercials about how driving a (gas) car made you somehow complicit? Of course it has a lot to do with the party in power too. When Republicans go to war it’s for oil and bad. When democrats go to war it’s to save poor people (women) and gays.
I think the global media saw Afghanistan as falling into this latter category. Something Samantha Powers would have urged-on. What did we hear about from elites when Trump was considering his withdrawal? All the complaints were either, “we’re back at safe havens for terrorism” or “but what about all the females that have rights now?” The media chat was largely about the females and the generals were fear mongering about more Al Q hijacked planes crashing all over America.
But the media doesn’t care about terrorism. They care about females in Afghanistan that may lose their rights. That’s what this is about. That’s why the media is angry at Biden and this pullout. It puts women and recycling programs in Afghanistan in peril.
So saying they love war in general probably isn’t specific enough. They like the idea of going to war for - of all excuses - humanitarian reasons.
Self-important academics wanted to import third wave feminism (which a lot of people in the West already cannot stand) to Afghanistan and tried to lecture Pashtun tribesmen about "toxic masculinity." At the same time things like the sexual abuse of children, rapes by warlord forces, and war widows being forced to perform sexual favors just to get the compensation they were promised to feed their families was outright ignored. These things happened all the time. Where was the media outrage? Say what you will about the Taliban and their views towards women, but they would at least go after and execute rapists back in the day. So now you have a bunch of stupid, self righteous, warmongering, nation building academics wondering where it all went wrong. They can go to hell.
Funny you say this. For years “the Taliban” was my shorthand for backwards authoritarian savagery. Recently I’ve been joking (only partly) that the Taliban taking over us would not be the worst thing, given the state of our rudderless degeneracy and declining willingness to stand on principle or even make sense. It’s a sad realization that we can’t confidently condescend to the Taliban on every issue.
Now contrast that with what happened to Cuomo. (Cuomo was an ass, but the reasons for his resignation have little, if anything, to do with his attitude towards women. But look at how easy it is to recruit idiots to the cause!)
#MeToo is a farce used by the Oligarchy to hide from imbeciles the true intentions of the Empire.
"When democrats go to war it’s to save poor people (women) and gays."
Poe's Law.
You're making a joke right? Seriously, you cannot possibly believe this. Homelessness and Medicare for All could have been implemented at a much cheaper price than pretending to protect Afghani women. If the Empire cared at all, they would have left the Russians alone.
But the Empire wants to spread chaos. They've accomplished that in Afghanistan. It is time to leave and turn to Somalia. The Uyghurs have been radicalized. Xinjiang province is about to descend into chaos.
Domestic policy and imperialism aren’t not connected here. Read anything Samantha Powers has written about her hopes and dreams during the Obama years. Wars for humanitarian reasons = good.
I'm not saying Wikipedia is a definitive source. There is no such thing as a definitive source any longer in the USA. But I've read way too many books by people making statements that would set them up to be the 'good guy'. Power worked for Obama therefore she's a crook.
If Taibbi, Blumenthal, Mate, or Dore (there are others but let's keep the list short) want to defend her, I might change my mind. But the defining point is that she worked for Obama at the time that he destroyed Libya. Prima Facia evidence that she is lying.
I’m not defending her at all. My entire point was that progressives love certain types of war waged by their political allies. They call those wars “humanitarian wars.” They don’t live all wars. If a Republican goes to war, it’s wrong because it’s assumed to be a war for oil (or insert any other thing they can blame on greedy capitalists). But when progressives are in charge, they believe it’s righteous to go to war for what they call humanitarian purposes. That’s why the media hates this withdrawal. Afghanistan turned into a war of women’s rights, equity, recycling (I say recycling because Germany spent millions trying to get the Afghans to recycle). I think we’re agreeing with each other. Ot sure where the disconnect is.
I don’t recall any significant discussion about Iraq being linked to a humanitarian crisis. I vaguely recall something like this, but the media by and large went along with the WMD push. They would later use the trouble in Syria and Libya to frame an argument for war on humanitarian grounds. And no news agency clings harder to that narrative than the BBC. They love a capsized boat full of North African or Middle East islamists trying to come to Europe. And now they can get enough of the pictures of throngs of afghanis tasing their babies over the walls at US or British soldiers.
“What does the West owe Afghanistan…?”
But I agree with you in that the media is corrupt. They have commercialized chaos - although I don’t think that’s altogether new, just more powerful in the digital age - and now foment chaos in order to get viewers so they can sell commercials. All under the guise of being a trusted source - the only place to get “truth.” And progressives believe this more than anything. Liberals have shifted completely away from questioning rulers to demanding heavier rule. All while shouting that trump was a tyrant. It’s fascinating.
Wow a lot of people had to die for us to return from whence we came.
Michael points out that we are being told the war was not the problem, ending the war is the problem. That might suggest we will make the same mistake again, so I ask you, who shall we destroy next?
My bet would be Iran. North Korea, maybe but that would be a tougher sell - insufficiently Muslim.
The amount of loud shouting and condemnation going on currently is unreal. I thought Trump was very subjectively treated, but I almost feel worse for Biden right now. Biden (for all of his many, many faults) may have made the best Presidential decision in my 30 odd years on this planet. Instead of breathing that huge sigh of relief I feel, we are witnessing just how deep the rot of the MIC runs. It's just incredible. Similar to TDS, I am astounded to see so many typically level minds off kilter on this one. Dude! We just got out of Afghanistan! We already looked like complete idiots. We should be celebrating.
Do not forget about the oh so convenient timing of the fake "Russian Bounties" story when Trump wanted to pull out.
I mostly agree. Biden does deserve credit for actually pulling the plug. And we should be celebrating the end of a fiasco that has cost so much blood and treasure. I also agree that those criticizing Biden for going ahead with the withdrawal. As far as I'm concerned the neocons of both parties can pound sand. But I can't agree is letting Biden off the hook for the incompetent execution of the withdrawal. It's not just optics. This is an ongoing disaster, and only luck will cause this to end without American civilian dead or held hostage.
Should be: I also agree that those criticizing Biden for going ahead with the withdrawal are wrong.
Biden's decision to get out of Afghanistan has little to do with the failure of the USA to train anybody. In fact, the chaos the USA has left is -exactly- the goal. The poorly executed "withdrawal"; the failure to warn our allies; the breakdown of the visa approvals -- it is all planned. Our Generals aren't so stupid that they couldn't have organized an orderly withdrawal if they wanted it.
Rainer Shea explains it quite well here: https://www.opednews.com/articles/Afghanistan-s-ongoing-dest-by-Rainer-Shea-Afghanistan-War_Destabilization-210818-725.html
The "pivot to Asia" is moving onward. It may not make sense, but this withdrawal is to set up chaos in Xinjiang. Look at a map.
We may be out of Afghanistan, but that's because our bombers no longer have targets in Afghanistan and the USA has moved on to Somalia. https://nypost.com/2021/07/21/us-launches-first-airstrike-in-somalia-under-biden/
The Empire isn't run by idiots. It is run by megalomaniacs. Every James Bond movie you ever saw shows you the real criminal behind the scenes. The problem is that M is on their side.
Also, this Rainer Shea fellow has the hammer and sickle in his Twitter bio and also recently wrote a defense of the DPRK, calling it “the true people’s welfare state!” For real? The DPRK is one of the most repressive countries in the world.
While I agree with the sentiment and don’t doubt that China plays a role in why we are still there, your initial article uses a laughably blatant bit of deceptively-edited CCP propaganda from YouTube as a source, which makes me doubt their credibility. There is also the reality that China was still barely more than a 3rd world country 20 years ago when we went in the first place.
Good one. All you need to know, re: the media (my resume: Boston Globe, Wall Street Journal, and freelanced for countless other magazines like The Nation and wrote op eds in USA Today, etc. 20 years) is that they can always be counted on (always and forever) to be pro-globalist, pro-corporate power, and pro-CIA/Pentagon (read: war). Doesn't matter the network. To this day, Hannity is still wearing FBI and CIA pins on his lapel...MSNBC's Brian Williams is famous for this "big beautiful bombs" commentary over Syria. The one time he was happy about Trump.
Sorry Mike, but the withdrawal was as the Brits like to say a "massive cock up." Troops pulled out before equipment, Bagram closed down way too early, routes to the airport unsecured, the list of ineptitude goes on and on and I will criticize it as much as I like. That being said, too much of the criticism is directed at Biden. Shocking, I know, and this is coming from someone who cannot stand the guy (decades of reasons to dislike him). Biden is just an empty suit these days. He is lucky if he even remembers what decade it is and can barely even answer questions. I seriously doubt he was involved in the detailed planning of this. He just reads lies off the teleprompter and leaving Afghanistan is a decision I respect him for. No, the people I hate are our usual group of State Department and Pentagon idiots. These empty suits have been useless for decades. If they ever had to work a blue collar job the boss would be constantly yelling "YOU HAD ONE JOB!" It is their job to know things, plan things, and prepare for contingencies. Having a few contingency plans in case a country falls apart while you are leaving just seems common sense, not to mention that these idiots had MONTHS to plan for this. For me the biggest lesson of Afghanistan is that America's State Department and Pentagon is populated by useless, bipartisan, career charlatans and has been for decades.
Give them some credit. They will at least respect your pronouns.
The cock-up was meant to happen.
https://www.opednews.com/articles/Afghanistan-s-ongoing-dest-by-Rainer-Shea-Afghanistan-War_Destabilization-210818-725.html
Halon's Razor is not always applicable. Especially when dealing with Empire.
I think it’s too broad to say that the media loves war. I know I know. It gets em headlines at the outset. So the beginning of wars is profitable. In that regard, the tragedy and spectacle, yes they love those shock and awe moments.
But Afghanistan for progressives is a war that exported wokeness under a Biden admin, and before that it advocates simple western ideals like sexual equality. If we were to go to war for oil - which is how they protested some of the GWOT actions. Remember the commercials about how driving a (gas) car made you somehow complicit? Of course it has a lot to do with the party in power too. When Republicans go to war it’s for oil and bad. When democrats go to war it’s to save poor people (women) and gays.
I think the global media saw Afghanistan as falling into this latter category. Something Samantha Powers would have urged-on. What did we hear about from elites when Trump was considering his withdrawal? All the complaints were either, “we’re back at safe havens for terrorism” or “but what about all the females that have rights now?” The media chat was largely about the females and the generals were fear mongering about more Al Q hijacked planes crashing all over America.
But the media doesn’t care about terrorism. They care about females in Afghanistan that may lose their rights. That’s what this is about. That’s why the media is angry at Biden and this pullout. It puts women and recycling programs in Afghanistan in peril.
So saying they love war in general probably isn’t specific enough. They like the idea of going to war for - of all excuses - humanitarian reasons.
Self-important academics wanted to import third wave feminism (which a lot of people in the West already cannot stand) to Afghanistan and tried to lecture Pashtun tribesmen about "toxic masculinity." At the same time things like the sexual abuse of children, rapes by warlord forces, and war widows being forced to perform sexual favors just to get the compensation they were promised to feed their families was outright ignored. These things happened all the time. Where was the media outrage? Say what you will about the Taliban and their views towards women, but they would at least go after and execute rapists back in the day. So now you have a bunch of stupid, self righteous, warmongering, nation building academics wondering where it all went wrong. They can go to hell.
Funny you say this. For years “the Taliban” was my shorthand for backwards authoritarian savagery. Recently I’ve been joking (only partly) that the Taliban taking over us would not be the worst thing, given the state of our rudderless degeneracy and declining willingness to stand on principle or even make sense. It’s a sad realization that we can’t confidently condescend to the Taliban on every issue.
Bingo.
Look at Tara Reade and Biden.
Now contrast that with what happened to Cuomo. (Cuomo was an ass, but the reasons for his resignation have little, if anything, to do with his attitude towards women. But look at how easy it is to recruit idiots to the cause!)
#MeToo is a farce used by the Oligarchy to hide from imbeciles the true intentions of the Empire.
"When democrats go to war it’s to save poor people (women) and gays."
Poe's Law.
You're making a joke right? Seriously, you cannot possibly believe this. Homelessness and Medicare for All could have been implemented at a much cheaper price than pretending to protect Afghani women. If the Empire cared at all, they would have left the Russians alone.
But the Empire wants to spread chaos. They've accomplished that in Afghanistan. It is time to leave and turn to Somalia. The Uyghurs have been radicalized. Xinjiang province is about to descend into chaos.
Domestic policy and imperialism aren’t not connected here. Read anything Samantha Powers has written about her hopes and dreams during the Obama years. Wars for humanitarian reasons = good.
She was lying.
You've read Taibbi's withering expose of Obama right?
https://taibbi.substack.com/p/the-vanishing-legacy-of-barack-obama-147
Read Robert Parry's article from 2013 that was just reprinted.
https://consortiumnews.com/2021/08/16/hollywoods-dangerous-afghan-illusion-2/
Wikipedia says:
"She is considered to have been a key figure in the Obama administration in persuading the president to intervene militarily in Libya"
The Empire hides it's true intentions behind a "feel-good" cloak. And we keep falling for it.
Wikipedia. Wow. So, go read her book. Just go and read what she says about all that - her words.
Why?
I'm not saying Wikipedia is a definitive source. There is no such thing as a definitive source any longer in the USA. But I've read way too many books by people making statements that would set them up to be the 'good guy'. Power worked for Obama therefore she's a crook.
If Taibbi, Blumenthal, Mate, or Dore (there are others but let's keep the list short) want to defend her, I might change my mind. But the defining point is that she worked for Obama at the time that he destroyed Libya. Prima Facia evidence that she is lying.
I’m not defending her at all. My entire point was that progressives love certain types of war waged by their political allies. They call those wars “humanitarian wars.” They don’t live all wars. If a Republican goes to war, it’s wrong because it’s assumed to be a war for oil (or insert any other thing they can blame on greedy capitalists). But when progressives are in charge, they believe it’s righteous to go to war for what they call humanitarian purposes. That’s why the media hates this withdrawal. Afghanistan turned into a war of women’s rights, equity, recycling (I say recycling because Germany spent millions trying to get the Afghans to recycle). I think we’re agreeing with each other. Ot sure where the disconnect is.
Great comment!
I don’t recall any significant discussion about Iraq being linked to a humanitarian crisis. I vaguely recall something like this, but the media by and large went along with the WMD push. They would later use the trouble in Syria and Libya to frame an argument for war on humanitarian grounds. And no news agency clings harder to that narrative than the BBC. They love a capsized boat full of North African or Middle East islamists trying to come to Europe. And now they can get enough of the pictures of throngs of afghanis tasing their babies over the walls at US or British soldiers.
“What does the West owe Afghanistan…?”
But I agree with you in that the media is corrupt. They have commercialized chaos - although I don’t think that’s altogether new, just more powerful in the digital age - and now foment chaos in order to get viewers so they can sell commercials. All under the guise of being a trusted source - the only place to get “truth.” And progressives believe this more than anything. Liberals have shifted completely away from questioning rulers to demanding heavier rule. All while shouting that trump was a tyrant. It’s fascinating.
Not only that, but I see these pics and videos of Afghanis and they're not all wearing masks! And how are we supposed to know if they're vaccinated?!
It keeps getting worse!!
We've all got to withdraw our consent from this rotten regime, i.e. the criminal, incompetent, mass-murdering US govt. It's beyond saving.
Thank you !!! Also -- did you see:
1. US Created Al Qaeda & $2 Trillion War In Afghanistan—Aug 19 – OUTSTANDING Summary
https://youtu.be/rxHrdicNwss
2. Facebook's Partner: The Atlantic Council (5 Frightening Facts) (rumble.com)
https://rumble.com/vleq6v-facebooks-partner-the-atlantic-council-5-frightening-facts.html
Facebook's Partner: The Atlantic Council (5 Frightening Facts)
YouTube demonetizes Jimmy Dore for criticizing AOC -- by using her own words
YouTube Suppresses Jimmy Dore's Criticism Of AOC - YouTube
3. Roaming Charges: When the Empire of Graveyards Falls in the Graveyard of Empires
Roaming Charges: When the Empire of Graveyards Falls in the Graveyard of Empires - CounterPunch.org
https://www.counterpunch.org/2021/08/20/roaming-charges-23/
BY Jeffrey St, Clair – Aug. 20, 2021 – IMPORTANT: This is incredibly well written !!!
I don't understand why they are not on sub-stack. And -- all the best and thank you for your work, Boris
Michael, what’s going on in Syria? MSM is silent.
What are the Russians up to?
Wow a lot of people had to die for us to return from whence we came.
Michael points out that we are being told the war was not the problem, ending the war is the problem. That might suggest we will make the same mistake again, so I ask you, who shall we destroy next?
My bet would be Iran. North Korea, maybe but that would be a tougher sell - insufficiently Muslim.